Prepressforums.com - The choice between Rampage, Nexxus, Prinergy

badge424 · #1 (**permalink**) 06-09-2006, 08:55 AM

We Currently own and use 2 PageFlow Rips with a variety of output devices.

Over the last month I have demo'd 3 RIP/Workflows (2 in-house and 1 WebEx). For starters, do not demo a workflow using WebEx! I believe this truly did put a negative spin on what could have been a decent workflow. That said.....

It's down to Rampage and Nexus.

My first instinct was that over the last five years Rampage has simply come much further in developing their product into a beast of a rip/workflow solution, and coupled it with unmatched support. (Rampage was running on a LAPTOP and took a job that was taking us days to get out and ATE IT UP AND SPIT IT OUT WITHOUT A SINGLE ERROR.

Artwork Systems still seems to be this cocky company who thinks that their s__t doesn't stink. Aside from that the PageFlow RIP in it's time was HANDS DOWN the best rip/trap/workflow on the market. Moving on...the Nexus has some great capabilities, but seems to be a bit complex and not quite as user friendly as I would like it to be. However I believe that they still have quite a kick-ass product that would fit nicely into most shops with any decent talent behind the wheel. For the most part a lot of what I was looking at seemed like smoke and mirrors, and it choked a bit on the same file that we flew through Rampage.

Now after scowering this site for negative and positive feedback regarding these two RIPs and their developers, it appears that their is a major support issue with Artwork Systems as well as other misc. issues. I can not find much negative feedback regarding Rampage and most issues that are posted here on the site are usually resolved within a post ot two.

Last but not least I made a couple of phone calls. I called Artwork Systems and Someone asked me where I was calling from and told me that I needed to speak with a certain individual. From there it was elevator music.....I hung up. I called Rampage, asked for support and in under a minute I was on the phone with a tech. I don't even own their product! (laughing)

Before we sign off on anything.....is there ANYTHING that ANYONE would like to add to any of this I a may not be seeing? Any info will be greatly appreciated.

macdevin · #2 (**permalink**) 06-09-2006, 09:09 AM

You are correct in your thinking! We would still have Rampage but because of how it traps we had to send it back. We now have Nexus, and like it. Yes, their support is bad and updates are not well tested. Nexus can trap better then any produuct I've seen, but their is still some major issuse.

You can do more with nexus as in workflows, but it takes somebody at the shop to have the know how. Rampage has the best interface, and the way it can handle multiple boxs just screems.

Good Luck!
Devin

badge424 · #3 (**permalink**) 06-09-2006, 11:08 AM

Hi Devin! Thanks for the quick reply. When you say you didn't like the way it traps, what exactly do you mean? We were actually impressed with the way trapping worked in Rampage.

Also, if you don't mind me asking, what kind of work does your shop do?

We have a mix of everything here. Catalogs, sellsheets, business cards, 1-color and up.

If you don't mind, pm me your contact info. We've been calling around to different shops in the area that are using Rampage to get a sense of how they like it. Maybe I could give you a call on Monday or Tuesday to bounce some questions off of you. Especially since you have worked with both. Thanks again.

badge424 · #4 (**permalink**) 06-09-2006, 11:09 AM

Hi Devin! Thanks for the quick reply. When you say you didn't like the way it traps, what exactly do you mean? We were actually impressed with the way trapping worked in Rampage.

Also, if you don't mind me asking, what kind of work does your shop do?

We have a mix of everything here. Catalogs, sellsheets, business cards, 1-color and up.

If you don't mind, pm me your contact info. We've been calling around to different shops in the area that are using Rampage to get a sense of how they like it. Maybe I could give you a call on Monday or Tuesday to bounce some questions off of you. Especially since you have worked with both. Thanks again.

macdevin · #5 (**permalink**) 06-09-2006, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by badge424

Hi Devin! Thanks for the quick reply. When you say you didn't like the way it traps, what exactly do you mean? We were actually impressed with the way trapping worked in Rampage.

Also, if you don't mind me asking, what kind of work does your shop do?

We have a mix of everything here. Catalogs, sellsheets, business cards, 1-color and up.

If you don't mind, pm me your contact info. We've been calling around to different shops in the area that are using Rampage to get a sense of how they like it. Maybe I could give you a call on Monday or Tuesday to bounce some questions off of you. Especially since you have worked with both. Thanks again.

Here is the problem with Rampage trap, It only looks down to see how it should trap. When it should be looking on what's it touching. I will see if I can dig up some of the problem test files that we had.

If we were strictly an offset shop on paper then we would have been ok since our traps are small. But with offset platic stock and larger silkscreen we can end up with very large traps and a poor trap will show.

The learning curve is much greater on Nexus and with poor support it makes it all that much worse when there is that problem that pop ups, and the job is due out. With Rampage it was easy like you said.

From the sounds of your shop, I would go with Rampage. If Artworks support was like rampage, then their would be no doubt with who I would go with. "Artworks"

Devin

Mikie · #6 (**permalink**) 06-10-2006, 06:42 PM

I will speak nicely of the Rampage people till the day I die. I've change platforms several times now, and they all work "about" the same, but like you said, you call Rampage, someone will immediatly talk to you. The best experience I've ever had with a company, both business and private. For example, the service tech for our platesetter was having problems fixing our "lines thru everything" issue. He started pointing to the Rampage box sending the data, so I called rampage, told them what we were getting on the plates...and before I could say anything else, the tech says, "can u overnight me some plates today?" " sure" next day they pinpointed it was a problem with the ram on the scsi controller board, gave me the probable module(they based this on the spacing of the repeat pattern of the lines we were getting) platesetter tech " oh, well i did replace the board, the new one didnt come with new ram so i jsut used the old ram" this was five days after first gettin the tech in to fix this problem btw...

I can't speak of how the workflow is now, or if I could really say it's "better" then the others I have used, but it should work fine for the type of work you do, i used it for 5 yrs in a commercial shop. Before that job, I worked in a totally dif kind of company with special trappin needs, loads of metallic inks, SS jobs, and like macdevin said, there is better trapping in that situation.

PantherMac · #7 (**permalink**) 06-12-2006, 04:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by badge424

It's down to Rampage and Nexus.

I'll be honest, I stopped reading at this point in your post:

I worked w/ Nexus for about 4-5 years at my last shop... we were a big artpro customer, and did a lot of beta testing of the new versions of the RIP for AWS.

I'm putting a CTP install on the floor in 6 weeks.

I'm bringing a Rampage in to drive it.

You got specific questions, fire me a PM.

- Mac

jimbroski · #8 (**permalink**) 10-20-2006, 04:23 AM

I have used Rampage, Nexus and PSM workflows. I worked at two other shops that were Rampage and one that had PSM. The PSM was pretty stable besides the bottleneck issues.

When I started using Rampage I found the workflow to be extremely fast and efficient. It ripped just about anything you put in its way, unless it was a really corrupt pdf or ps file. Hardly ever did I have to call support and when I did it was a great experience.

Where I am now we recently went from Delta to Nexus. At first I knew nothing about Nexus, as time went on I started realizing the huge mistake upper management did by switching to Nexus. Nexus modular workflow is very clunky and complex. You are limited with impositions, it flags just about anything you put thru there. Then you have to configure the workflow extensively to get anything to rip. It has been a very bad experience to say the least.

Then you call support and either you get some tech that is in training or you wait three hours to here from someone. It has happened so many times when the techs come out to the shop and while they are assisting with your issues they are receiving tech support calls from other people.
They also have a tendency to blame issues on the desktop applications.

It would be a poor management decision for anyone who is considering switching to Nexus unless you are trap happy shop that has 2-3 hours to turn-around jobs.

macdevin · #9 (**permalink**) 10-20-2006, 05:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimbroski

It would be a poor management decision for anyone who is considering switching to Nexus unless you are trap happy shop that has 2-3 hours to turn-around jobs.

I find this statment false! It does not take 2-3 hours to trap a job.
It does take a better understaning of trapping to get it to go thru.

If your an offset only shop, then I can see looking at another RIP system.
were not so we can have some very large trap, and Nexus to date is the only system that can trap 100% the we like. We had rampage....we got it because of Managment thought that any cheap operator can use it. It was great...fast...but the traps sucked.

As far as bulding workflows....I agree, but it's not that bad. It's not made for everybody in your shop to make workflows on the fly. But once your workflows are made, then it's balls to the walls.

I get asked weekly about doing some kind of automated workflow that will help the operators for a certain job....I can wip out a workflow in a matter of mins. So it's not that bad once you learn it.

Devin

jimbroski · #10 (**permalink**) 10-20-2006, 07:01 AM

Obviously it does not take 2 or 3 hours to trap in Nexus, but if you have a 128 page magazine and need special traps thru-out the book it would take about three times the the time. If you have worked in both Rampage and Nexus you would know the difference.

I agree you have more trap capabilities but why does everything take 3-4 steps when it should take one step, and forget about trying to edit traps in a raster workflow.

I am responsible for feeding two full web presses, one half web press, and two sheet fed presses. My operators do not have the luxury to wait hours for tech support or go thru work-arounds nor do I have the time to configure or create workflows. Right now I have over 15 workflows just to get as automated as possible. The more automation you want the more workflows you have to set.

Workflows made just to send a black and white proof to my desktop printer, you would think they would throw in a print feature in Insight or Edit.

Workflow to scale, workflow to do cmyk conversion, workflow for seps, workflow for pdfs, these are my reasons why Nexus does not work for me.