trapping issues

[kl3]

Hi all
been a long time since I've had a chance to visit perpress.com - nice to be back.
a technical question about trapping - I am having difficulty finding anyone to help me with this.
I work for a publishing company, and we have products printed by sheet fed and web printing. We recently started a new product that is printed with gravure printing and the results are quite different.
I have been told by the printers that it would help with registration issues if i could trap 2 (or more) colour boxes in InDesign (with reversed out text).
In other words, a 2-colour black, for instance (Cyan 60%, black 100%) should be set with spread and chokes.
this is what they say:

For reverse lettering (negative type) please use the dominant colour for shape, with the subordinate colours slightly larger (spread) to reduce register problems (colour creep)

I understand the priciples described, but have no idea how to do any of this in InDesign
Can anyone help?
all attenpts appreciated in advance
Karin

[beermonster]

this is gonna be a trial for indesign - you will have to think in layers, have elements expanded/stroked a little and different objects overprinting - and if you have several bits its going to be tough

alternatively you might end up creating shapes with "holes" in them (pathfinder here we come) and adjusting strokes and overprints

these kind of traps are easiest done in trap editors - prinergy does them quite nicely i seem to remember, and rampage as well. maybe pitstop will if you were happy pdf'ing out of indy - matt might help on that one

ask what their workflow is (if they have one) and go from there. personally speaking, traps are done on a job by job basis - my question is why they dont want to do it (when they could judge the best trap for the job - and adjust accordingly) and why are you doing it (when you will probably just stick to one method - which may not take into account press conditions).

not doubting you can do it at all - but if they have the tools, work with them and collaborate on how best to acheive it to give the best end result possible

good luck

[jimking]

Ditto above. Do ask what workflow they have and they should be the ones trapping your job.

[kl3]

o wow, seriously?!
ok, I hoped maybe it would be simpler
the other printers we use do the trapping themselves, but this lot sent us a bunch of tips, including this stuff re trapping.
but since the first (abominably printed) issue of this publication, there has been more attention paid, I think, as the registration has improved remarkably
hopefully i can leave it like that
I was just hoping to improve it a bit more, but the kind of work you describe won't fit into our workflow at all!
thanks for the advice, though

k

[beermonster]

well if you're in the front end at the design stage maybe you can bare in mind trapping issues when designing it

its not always possible of course, but think about the stock, colour limits, blacks/rich blacks (no 4 colour blacks), i mean - ask the question - just because you CAN make a black with a cyan (a shiner) - do you HAVE TO - does black on its own look good on the stock anyway? dont put yellow type/elements on cyan/bluey backgrounds - they get a green halo around when trapped - little things like that - but from the design view as long as it looks good eh.

doing the trapping yourself shows a positive attitude and i like that. it should really be down to the printer though - if i receive files with trapping in them, its rare i dont have to either re-do it properly or adjust the spreads and chokes for the press conditions, but a compromise could be reached by, if possible, designing a print friendly product.

mind you - its a rare thing! i had this BIG uk repro company send me files for these cake boxes - "yes its trapped properly" they said...

...sadly no - spot colours overprinting each other that our press didnt want - so off i went putting it right. there was even a 2 colour barcode

its good a printer advising you on trapping, and it shows at least a good level of communication and understanding, but in my opinion its a skill best left to prepress at the folks who will print it.

if they print it dodgy - oh dear - there's plenty of hungry printers out there who wont!

[sequoyah]

One way to achieve this kind of trap at the front end is to stroke the white type with a 0.1% tint of the less dominant color using a very small stroke(0.1-0.5 pt.). The idea is that the low 0.1% tint will actually not hold on the film or plate, so it effectively creates a spread of the color.

You can stroke live type in InDesign without having to convert it to outlines.

Give it a go.